Category Archives: Muslim and Non-Muslim Dialogue

Debate Review: Is Islam a Religion of Peace [Br. Shadid Lewis vs Robert Spencer]

Note: This review is based on the video posted by Br. Shadid on his YouTube page. He has stated that his rebuttal and portions of the cross fire questioning are missing. Regardless of what is missing, this is a review on the debate ‘as it is’. 

Opening Statements:

Br. Shadid:

He begins by defining the delimits of the topic. What exactly is peace and how does Islam relate to it? What is the definition of peace which Mr. Spencer is operating with? From the very start, Br. Shadid is laying his logic clearly on the table. Merely asking, “Is Islam a Religion of Peace?“, does not allow for the topic to be discussed. Is peace here supposed to mean pacifism? Outlined and strategical aggression? Interpersonal or between state and citizens of the state?

He doesn’t exactly convey his point very eloquently, nor does he stick to his line of reasoning perfectly. At the beginning he jumps around a bit after providing a dictionary definition of peace, and comments on the previous speakers before him (mind you who were not part of the debate), and then he comments on Arab Nation spending on weapons, versus that of America’s Military Industrial Complex. Unfortunately,  all of these topics in less than two minutes, muddled his opening statement.

He recovers though and makes quite the point. The so called Axis of Evil of nations, some of which are Muslim majority – have a total weapons and defense expenditure of $15 billion dollars combined, whereas the United States alone has a budget of $800+ billion dollars for the very same purpose. Even if Muslims did have goals of war – their expenditure simply does not allow for, or demonstrate this. He then moved on to proving that Islam does promote peace, on the basis of one the dictionary definitions of peace which he provided earlier. Somehow a few comments about taqiyyah got jumbled in there by him – which again, muddied the waters, taking away from what could have been a clear and consistent message.

Despite disrupting his outlined flow on the topic of Islam and Peace, Br. Shadid did present a solid rebuttal to the place of, and the use of taqiyyah in Islam. He then stops working with the four definitions of peace, and now discusses the place of abrogation of the peaceful verses of the Qur’aan. The flow of his argument (both overarching and sequentially) is very disruptive and a bit all over the place.

Br. Shadid discusses the validity of the translation of some verses, provides his reasoning on the exegetical sciences and then rests on the verses which clearly outline the conditions for warfare in the Qur’aan, specifically those of Qur’aan 2:190-194.  He then returned to one of the four definitions of peace, indicating that Islam does allow for peace treaties and this therefore fulfills another one of the definitions given. Cleverly, knowing that Mr. Spencer would eventually comment on the jizya and subjugation, Br. Shadid does sneak it in that even the polytheists of Makkah in the treaty of Hudaibiyah were not subject to the tax or monetary tribute. Br. Shadid in the closing moments then states that Islam is not a faith of pacifism.

Robert Spencer:

He began by saying that his statements would be solely based on Islamic source texts, written by Islamic scholarship, therefore his statements would be credible and seemingly unbiased. Spencer though, begins with his foot in his mouth by quoting one of the members of the Taliban who indicates that Jihad is recommended. Mr. Spencer says this, despite the fact that the Taliban’s fight is against Christian American soldiers invading a Muslim country. For those with a bit more awareness, his first point of contention aided Br. Shadid’s opening statement concerning Christian Americans and their war machine.

Spencer then quotes 2 or 3 other Jihadists, to bolster his position, despite these cases being few – he then mentions one of the Jihadists who claims his acts are in response to American war tactics and incidents. Once again, taking away from his position and aiding Br. Shadid’s. Spencer asks, where did these Jihadists get this understanding of Islam from, in this occasion, he paints them as students of knowledge – despite a significant majority of the exemplars used having no Islamic certification in any area of Islamic study. He quotes a Qur’aanic ayah and then mentions that he will abide by what Mr. Lewis suggests and that he’d appeal to a scholar on understanding the verse. In this regard, he chose Maulana Moududi (d. 1979) whom he says teaches that Muslims must usurp political power from any and all non-Muslim led nations.

Spencer then claims to agree with Br. Shadid that we cannot judge a faith based on what its members do, but based on what the faith itself teaches. He then goes to Maulana Moududi’s commentary on Qur’aan 3:28 – on the topic of taqiyyah, he agrees that one of its uses is during a state of persecution or imminent danger. His logic is therefore, that since Muslims claim America is at war with them, they are therefore in danger and currently must use taqiyyah at all times. Br. Shadid already specified what the circumstances were using a graphic retelling of a Grey’s Anatomy episode, thereby cancelling Robert’s misuse of reasoning. On abrogation he agrees that Muslims do not have a set agreement on how many verses have been abrogated. At this point the camera cuts off and begins towards the end of his rebuttal to Br. Shadid.

Rebuttals:

Br. Shadid’s was cut by the camera and as such I am unable to comment on it.

Mr. Spencer says that non-Muslims are not compelled to believe in Islam, but they must live in humiliation and subjugation. He then cuts across to rebutting Br. Shadid on peace treaties by quoting from the fiqh manual, Reliance of the Traveller – his quotes entail that warfare is prescribed and that scholars accept and promote this book thereby promoting warfare. He goes on to say that Muslims only accept peace treaties so that they can regroup and gather themselves for when the truce ends (traditionally, all nations at war do this, claiming that Muslims alone do this is very silly).

My Conclusions:

Seeing as I’m unable to see Br. Shadid’s rebuttal, I’m unable to declare either him or Mr. Spencer the true ‘winner’. However, given what I have seen and heard, Br. Shadid did stand his ground and he did successfully pre-empt the arguments of Mr. Spencer. To his benefit, Br. Shadid disarmed Spencer from using his usual arguments and seemed to make Spencer quite subdued in his argumentation.

Br. Shadid however, did jump around a bit, but despite doing so – when he made a point, he was consistent, clear and delivered very strong points which rendered a majority of Spencer’s points moot. It is with great earnest that I look forward to seeing the final 5 minutes of Spencer’s opening statement and the entirety of his and Br. Shadid’s rebuttals.

However, given what I’ve seen, and without bias, Br. Shadid did put a muzzle on Spencer’s arguments leaving Spencer to argue a bit aimlessly and with his tail between his legs. I do admit, that I am disappointed that Br. Shadid was all over the place, but in the very short time of his opening statement, he covered every single topic Spencer could have brought forward (something which Spencer did commend him for during his opening statement), thus pre-empting a majority of his arguments and placing the upper hand in his favour.

As far as I can tell, if Spencer’s opening statement and partial rebuttal are anything to judge by, despite his oratory skills, he has not defeated Br. Shadid.

and Allaah knows best.

Crying Wolf: Christian Martyr Stories False, Largely Fictional says Christian Academic

Commonly referred to as the ‘martyrologies‘ by scholarship, these are the stories, and oral traditions descended from the earliest Christians concerning their persecution by Roman authorities during the first 30 – 50 years of the post-Christ, Messianic Judaic Graeco Roman movement. These stories served as heart wrenching, emotional tales to spur on ‘faith revivals’ and to win conversions at that time. We see many missionaries currently using this means of emotional propaganda to gain sympathy for their faith in trying to persuade ignorant and soft hearted individuals into buying into their misinformation for either proselytizing or for donations.

Similar to the Gospel traditions (Synoptic and Johannine), most have come to realise that a vast majority of proto-orthodox Christian literature descended from the earliest Messianic Judaic Graeco Roman traditions are mere myths, inventions, stories, fables, propaganda. One brave and fairly well known Christian academic has tried to enlighten the blind Christian world (not academics, whom mostly  and widely support her) about these myths. Here is the interview with her:

Share this with your Christian friends. Let them be enlightened that even the most beautiful stories from their earliest traditions are falsified. It’s time they attain some awareness.

 

The Trinity: A Graphical Representation

This is quite disturbing. It’s also quite interesting. What is it? It’s a graphical representation of what the Holey Trinity is supposed to look like. From three Jesus look a likes holding hands to a creature with 6 eyes, 3 noses and 3 mouths – it’s as raw as you can get. I worship the God who is unseen, perfect and of which no mind can behold, I don’t worship what I can only describe as a monstrosity.

and God knows best.

The Role of the Gospel and Christ by Preachers in Africa by Belgium’s King

This is the letter from King Leopold II of Belgium to Colonial Missionaries, 1883. It’s a bit hard to stomach, but this is the harsh reality of why our African brothers and Sisters were converted from Islam (and their local faiths) to accept the religion of the ‘white man’:

Reverends, Fathers and Dear Compatriots:

The task that is given to fulfill is very delicate and requires much tact. You will go certainly to evangelize, but your evangelization must inspire above all Belgium interests. Your principal objective in our mission in the Congo is never to teach the niggers to know God, this they know already. They speak and submit to a Mungu, one Nzambi, one Nzakomba, and what else I don’t know. They know that to kill, to sleep with someone else’s wife, to lie and to insult is bad. Have courage to admit it; you are not going to teach them what they know already. Your essential role is to facilitate the task of administrators and industrials, which means you will go to interpret the gospel in the way it will be the best to protect your interests in that part of the world. For these things, you have to keep watch on disinteresting our savages from
the richness that is plenty [in their underground. To avoid that, they get interested in it, and make you murderous] competition and dream one day to overthrow you.

Your knowledge of the gospel will allow you to find texts ordering, and encouraging your followers to love poverty, like “Happier are the poor because they will inherit the heaven” and, “It’s very difficult for the rich to enter the kingdom of God.” You have to detach from them and make them disrespect everything which gives courage to affront us. I make reference to their Mystic System and their war fetish – warfare protection – which they pretend not to want to abandon, and you must do everything in your power to make it disappear.

Your action will be directed essentially to the younger ones, for they won’t revolt when the recommendation of the priest is contradictory to their parent’s teachings. The children have to learn to obey what the missionary recommends, who is the father of their soul. You must singularly insist on their total submission and obedience, avoid developing the spirit in the schools, teach students to read and not to reason. There, dear patriots, are some of the principles that you must apply. You will find many other books, which will be given to you at the end of this conference. Evangelize the niggers so that they stay forever in submission to the white colonialists, so they never revolt against the restraints they are undergoing. Recite every day – “Happy are those who are weeping because the kingdom of God is for them.”

Thus, this letter explains one of the most fundamental differences between Christianity and Islam. Whereas Islam guides you to serve God and earn His reward from it, Christianity in Africa was used as a tool to dull the senses, control the emotions of our African brothers and sisters. Christianity was a means to control the beautiful African peoples of whom our master Bilal (may Allaah be pleased with him) and our other teacher, mother and scholar – Umm Ayman (may Allaah be pleased with her – covert to Islam and wet nurse to the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him) came from. We mourn what Christianity has done to Africa and we pray for the day it abandons the whips and chains of the Cross.

and Allaah knows best.

One of these things is not like the other….

بِسۡمِ ٱللهِ ٱلرَّحۡمَـٰنِ ٱلرَّحِيمِ ,

Acts 9:5-6 (KJV):

And he said, Who art thou, Lord? And the Lord said, I am Jesus whom thou persecutest: it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks. And he trembling and astonished said, Lord, what wilt thou have me to do? And the Lord said unto him, Arise, and go into the city, and it shall be told thee what thou must do.

Acts 9:5-6 (NIV):

 “Who are you, Lord?” Saul asked. “I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting,” he replied.  “Now get up and go into the city, and you will be told what you must do.”

Is it just me, or does something happen to be missing?

8th Anniversary of Shaykh Ahmed Deedat’s Passing

بِسۡمِ ٱللهِ ٱلرَّحۡمَـٰنِ ٱلرَّحِيمِ ,

August 8th, 2005. That was the day the da’wah luminary, the forefather to contemporary da’wah carriers  passed away after a career in which cc-2013-deedathe inspired millions to carry on the torch of Islam. His legacy is one of awe and pure class, not only did he rise to the very top during his time, but his efforts opened the way for Muslims to re-engage Christianity and to return to giving da’wah in a mass scale. Whether today is the final day of fasting or ‘Eid for you, please make du’a for this man, that Allaah rewards him with Jannat ul Firdous and that his grave is spacious and filled with the fragrance of Jannah. Ameen.

His many debates, lectures and dialogues are still very relevant and useful. Despite deceits of from popular missionaries, they have been unable to match the scale to which this man brought modern apologetics to. Thousands lined attended his debates, tens of thousands, even hundreds of thousands to this day continue to watch and learn from his videos. I don’t know of a single Christian missionary today who can full a stadium, or theater with several thousand persons. Muslims and Christians alike, traveled far and wide to meet him in South Africa, many sought his guidance in which he dedicated the time and effort to aiding them over the phone. Even when he got ill, the fire inside him to guide the misguided and defend Islam never stopped. Below is the video of his funeral, watch the day that a lion amongst men passed into a better world.

wa Allaahu ‘Alam.

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